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  • The Psychology Of Previous Investment

    We can call it whatever we want but it's ego and ego always confuses an issue

    "It damages our ego to admit we were wrong, so we continue to work to support our initial poor decision."

    http://www.activeresponsetraining.ne...ous-investment
    Last edited by ricco; 12-04-2017, 14:02.
    "I suppose it's tempting, if the only tool you have is a hammer, to treat everything as if it were a nail...." ~Abraham Maslow~

    "Skill makes you harder to kill" ~ Unknown

  • #2
    Good article ricco and worthy of consideration. My choice works the best for me, and I have come back to it time and again. No instructor that has seen me shoot has ever said anything about how I'd do better with another choice.

    ETA After thinking a bit, I recalled one suggestion that Ayoob's instructor, (Peter Chinn, if memory serves) made regarding the frame size of the handgun I used. I took it and switched to an old Colt that I had with me and did somewhat better with it. It was strange because Chinn said he thought I'd do better with a larger size frame and the Colt I used was actually smaller. It could be that I was somewhat more used to the Colt because I had carried it for quite a while.
    Last edited by gerhard1; 12-05-2017, 13:10. Reason: ETA
    Taceant colloquia. Effugiat risus. Hic locus est ubi mors gaudet succurrere vitae.
    The Pale Horse available on Amazon for your digital reader.

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    • #3
      Ya know the more I look at this stuff the less interested I am in this or that gun or this or that ammo

      Given a choice I would much rather take a 1/10 second off my GOTX time than to have some mega dollar pistol with all the gee gaws

      In terms of close up fast breaking CCW SELF DEFENSE, reliability is paramount, past that........meh

      "I suppose it's tempting, if the only tool you have is a hammer, to treat everything as if it were a nail...." ~Abraham Maslow~

      "Skill makes you harder to kill" ~ Unknown

      Comment


      • #4
        This principle was published decades ago as the "sunk costs fallacy".

        It was one of the more interesting principles I learned in High School Psych way back when Psych was a thing students studied in public school. I doubt it is being taught outside of college anymore.
        For the Angel of Death spread his wings on the blast,
        And breathed in the face of the foe as he passed;
        And the eyes of the sleepers waxed deadly and chill,
        And their hearts but once heaved, and for ever grew still!
        -Lord Byron (=5 lines)

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        • #5
          Originally posted by ricco View Post
          Ya know the more I look at this stuff the less interested I am in this or that gun or this or that ammo

          Given a choice I would much rather take a 1/10 second off my GOTX time than to have some mega dollar pistol with all the gee gaws

          In terms of close up fast breaking CCW SELF DEFENSE, reliability is paramount, past that........meh
          Are you waiting for me to agree with you? Once a handgun has proven itself as reliable, that's half of the battle. The other half is skill improvement and maintenance. I don't quote from movies very often but Jack Reacher had a line that is quite true. "It is a perishable skill." It is indeed. That's why I practice so much. Well, one reason. I also enjoy it immensely.

          Off-hand pure target shooting I am rotten at. Jeff Cooper made a point one time that the practical shooter is not necessarily more accurate than the target shooter. From off-hand, he may be less so. But, he went on, the practical shooter strikes a much heavier blow and he does it much, much quicker.
          Taceant colloquia. Effugiat risus. Hic locus est ubi mors gaudet succurrere vitae.
          The Pale Horse available on Amazon for your digital reader.

          Comment


          • #6
            Tommorow i will post a link to a review of John Correia's study of 12,000 gunfights that he presented at Tom Given's 2017 Rangemaster Instructor Conference

            "I suppose it's tempting, if the only tool you have is a hammer, to treat everything as if it were a nail...." ~Abraham Maslow~

            "Skill makes you harder to kill" ~ Unknown

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by ricco View Post
              Ya know the more I look at this stuff the less interested I am in this or that gun or this or that ammo

              Given a choice I would much rather take a 1/10 second off my GOTX time than to have some mega dollar pistol with all the gee gaws

              In terms of close up fast breaking CCW SELF DEFENSE, reliability is paramount, past that........meh
              I'd say "in the terms of close up fast breaking CCW SELF DEFENSE, reliability is paramount," is an accurate statement but then again reliability is the one must have in any defensive firearm regardless of circumstances.

              Where I start to see an issue with solely focusing on reliability is when we begin to branch out from there. I absolutely believe the sudden/surprising assault w/i that 9 to 20 feet is the most probably of circumstances but it is not the only possibility. This is why, most efficient over the broadest range of probable circumstances, is so important to remember.

              If I knew beyond doubt that I would be attacked from contact distance and by a single assailant I would carry a J-Frame, AIWB.

              If I knew I would be required to incapacitate a threat at 20 feet and could only have a handgun I'd carry a longslide Glock or M&P, AIWB.

              But I don't so I carry the tool that's most efficient over the broadest range of probable circumstances. Compromise is unfortunately a part of CCW.

              There are definately designs that lend themselves to being more efficient over the braodest range of probable circumstances. Fortunately there are different manufacturers that produce such a handgun. Find the one that fits your hand.

              Aftermarket triggers, sights, gunsmithing, etc. are typically unneeded on a quality manufactured defensive handgun.

              Gear is important. Skill is important. The ability to appropriately apply skill in context is more important.

              A skilled person capable of applying thay skill can get further with less efficient tools than an unskilled person with the most efficient tools. Now a skilled person capable of applying that skill with the most efficient tools will likely get much further than either of those.

              “as a species we are reluctant to abandon any path we’ve set down, once we’ve made the commitment to set down the path.”

              He’s essentially speaking of inertia. In any endeavor, we as a species seem reluctant to change course (even if it is in our best interests) if we have heavily invested (either emotionally or financially) in a certain technology or outcome. Some people might call this “throwing good money after bad”. It’s the idea that once we make up our minds and commit to a particular course of action, we become psychologically wedded to that decision, even when all indicators logically call for a change of course.

              It’s what happens when we let our ego get involved in our decision making process. We convince ourselves that our decisions are optimal. It damages our ego to admit we were wrong, so we continue to work to support our initial poor decision.
              The reason I'm so adamant about ridding emotion from personal defense.

              Failure is an opportunity to learn.

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              • #8
                The pistol needs to be adequate and most quality service size pistols are adequate. most are more accurate than average person can hold and if we don't futz around with them trying to mke them better they are more often than not dead nuts reliable

                My point on "this or that gun" was the minutea that starts gun nerd debates, same with my comment on ammo



                "I suppose it's tempting, if the only tool you have is a hammer, to treat everything as if it were a nail...." ~Abraham Maslow~

                "Skill makes you harder to kill" ~ Unknown

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by ricco View Post
                  The pistol needs to be adequate and most quality service size pistols are adequate. most are more accurate than average person can hold and if we don't futz around with them trying to mke them better they are more often than not dead nuts reliable

                  My point on "this or that gun" was the minutea that starts gun nerd debates, same with my comment on ammo

                  The discussions on ammunition are hilarious.
                  Failure is an opportunity to learn.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Under most conditions, I'd avoid carrying a 44 Magnum or larger, although I have carried my 629 Mountain Gun and when I was living in Seattle, my 6" 29. If I ever carried magnum rounds in them it was rare, if not not actually never. 44 Special rounds are plenty.

                    My carrying a 22 rimfire was rare as well, usually confined to cases where larger guns in more effective caliber was very hard to do.

                    In between these two extremes, it really doesn't matter a lot what you carry.
                    Taceant colloquia. Effugiat risus. Hic locus est ubi mors gaudet succurrere vitae.
                    The Pale Horse available on Amazon for your digital reader.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      A friend had a S&W 629 Mountain Gun, I never got to shoot it but he it was rather unpleasant with magnums
                      "I suppose it's tempting, if the only tool you have is a hammer, to treat everything as if it were a nail...." ~Abraham Maslow~

                      "Skill makes you harder to kill" ~ Unknown

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by gerhard1 View Post
                        Under most conditions, I'd avoid carrying a 44 Magnum or larger, although I have carried my 629 Mountain Gun and when I was living in Seattle, my 6" 29. If I ever carried magnum rounds in them it was rare, if not not actually never. 44 Special rounds are plenty.

                        My carrying a 22 rimfire was rare as well, usually confined to cases where larger guns in more effective caliber was very hard to do.

                        In between these two extremes, it really doesn't matter a lot what you carry.
                        In what conditions would you find a 5" or 6"revolver chambered in 44 magnum more beneficial then say a 4" revolver chambered in .38 special? Let's assume it's an identical revolver except for barrel length and chambering for the sake of simplification.
                        Failure is an opportunity to learn.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by mjkeat View Post

                          In what conditions would you find a 5" or 6"revolver chambered in 44 magnum more beneficial then say a 4" revolver chambered in .38 special? Let's assume it's an identical revolver except for barrel length and chambering for the sake of simplification.
                          Fair question; and to be honest, I can't think of any real great advantage. Of course, I am now looking at it from the perspective of a much-older man. I think, and admittedly, this is mostly intuition on my part, about the only thing that the larger caliber would give is a slightly greater margin of error in shot placement.

                          The 38 in an N-frame is a very controllable round and very easy to shoot so that is what I almost always carry in them now. But that is only occasionally.

                          Then too, consider that my gunsmith and I had a game of 'where is it?' in which he would try to guess where I was carrying a large gun--usually an N-frame S&W--and we'd get a good laugh out if it after I showed where I was carrying it. That was really one of the very few times time I ever carried my 6" 29.

                          FTR, the guns I carried when I lived in Seattle were almost always medium frame Colt and S&W and one small frame 4" Colt.
                          Taceant colloquia. Effugiat risus. Hic locus est ubi mors gaudet succurrere vitae.
                          The Pale Horse available on Amazon for your digital reader.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by gerhard1 View Post

                            Fair question; and to be honest, I can't think of any real great advantage. Of course, I am now looking at it from the perspective of a much-older man. I think, and admittedly, this is mostly intuition on my part, about the only thing that the larger caliber would give is a slightly greater margin of error in shot placement.
                            What does the real world tell us about this (text in bold)?

                            What are the disadvantages of this .cal and typical size of handgun that is paired with this .cal?
                            Failure is an opportunity to learn.

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                            • #15
                              I had a S&W 28 and a S&W 66 at the same time both 4 inch barrels

                              No CCW then so I can't comment on draw to first shot time but there was a noticable difference in recoil when using the same ammo

                              Whether it would have made difference in a self defense incident I can't say

                              For close up stuff it probably wouldn't matter much, at greater distance the extra weight of the 28 might be better
                              "I suppose it's tempting, if the only tool you have is a hammer, to treat everything as if it were a nail...." ~Abraham Maslow~

                              "Skill makes you harder to kill" ~ Unknown

                              Comment

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