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  • Rip 9 mm

    Know this ammo has a thread on it already, but I wasn't able to find it. Anyway this is an interesting video on it.

    Like I say, it looks interesting but I think I'll stick to Speer GDHP.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NuHhJ3NEAF0

    Does anyone have any other suggestions for 9 mm? I am not at the point where I'm carrying my 986 yet, but I'd like to get your thoughts.
    Taceant colloquia. Effugiat risus. Hic locus est ubi mors gaudet succurrere vitae.
    The Pale Horse available on Amazon for your digital reader.

  • #2
    Gold Dot 124gr +P has been getting stellar results, used by Topeka PD and NYPD, others too.

    I did read that some 9mm loads get good velocity from snubby revawvers, don't remember which gun but several different good defensive loads were up into the 11-1200fps range; not bad from a snub, better than from some of the baby 9's. I'd be curious as to the numbers from your new toy, what with the longer barrel and all.

    RIP is just another of the 'wonder bullets' that 'will replace all the old-timey (read: 'tried and true') conventional hollow points'; by interpretation, 'just another gimmick'. Ace2
    Sometimes the term 'Idiot' is a description and not an insult.

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    • #3
      The R.I.P. is a gimmick ammo that I would not trust for self-defense. Right now I am stocking CCI Gold Dots and Federal HST. This Lehigh looks interesting--no hollow point to plug up.

      https://youtu.be/jnFwr2ycgXk
      http://youtu.be/ei8OK4WdoW0
      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_4CuH...e=channel_page
      http://www.stoppingpower.net/comment...tervention.asp
      http://youtu.be/wXwPtP-KDNk
      https://youtu.be/Iy71umadb6k

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      • #4
        Someone ought to do some figuring...............................

        The wondrous claim of the "flutes" is that they "channel" or "redirect" tissue out to the sides, enlarging the wound cavity.

        This would necessitate the fwd, movement be sufficiently high that the gyrostabilization spin rate dies not "hide" those flutes..................... effectively causing "cavitation", which would really destroy wound cavity expansion, no better than FMJ at that point.
        My standing offer for people's "old" MRE's, $1 each for dark brown bags. $12/case $2 each for the sand tan bags (newer). $24/case
        MAYBE, if they are 2010 and newer, I give you $2.50 each....... generosity.50 cents each for loose heaters. Where's those highlight video links mjkeat???????

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        • #5
          Oh wait.. that's not the "R.I.P." oh well,,, snake oil both of them.
          My standing offer for people's "old" MRE's, $1 each for dark brown bags. $12/case $2 each for the sand tan bags (newer). $24/case
          MAYBE, if they are 2010 and newer, I give you $2.50 each....... generosity.50 cents each for loose heaters. Where's those highlight video links mjkeat???????

          Comment


          • #6
            I will second Gold Dot and HST

            I can't say for a fact they will make the BG stop doing bad things faster than any other 9mm but from what I have read their overall performance is the most consistant
            "I suppose it's tempting, if the only tool you have is a hammer, to treat everything as if it were a nail...." ~Abraham Maslow~

            "Skill makes you harder to kill" ~ Unknown

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            • #7
              I would like some Winchester Black Talon or Ranger T or whatever the heck it is called now. Those expanded bullets look nasty!
              http://youtu.be/ei8OK4WdoW0
              http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_4CuH...e=channel_page
              http://www.stoppingpower.net/comment...tervention.asp
              http://youtu.be/wXwPtP-KDNk
              https://youtu.be/Iy71umadb6k

              Comment


              • #8
                There is some good reading in this article about bullet selection. I, like Goodtime Charlie, thought that Ranger T was the best of them but the article explains why another bullet is better suited. This article covers all defensive calibers in auto loaders and revolvers so it is quite lengthy. All of my stash of .45 ACP Hydra Shock ammo just became range ammo due to advances in bullet manufacturing.
                http://www.ar15.com/ammo/project/Sel...mozTocId759557

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                • #9
                  Funny, I have a Colt loaded with 230 gr talon, and a Smith with 125gr Hydra Shock Daily carry is a Glock with 115 gr Fed std pressure jhp cause I have two cases of it, and it goes in momma’s gun.
                  Originally posted by kscardsfan
                  Grain of salt hell, I'm taking it with a salt block from the feed store. Thats a big bunch of crap there.
                  Originally posted by zap
                  Winning a political debate on this forum is like winning the special Olympics....you would need to be a retard to enter it.

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                  • #10
                    Carry what you like, it probably won't matter enough to make a difference

                    Certainly not enough to argue about

                    People stop fighting for one of two reasons, they are afraid they are going to die and want to get help or their blood pressure drops to a point they lose consciousness


                    It hasn't been that many years ago that people thought an entry hole and an exit hole was preferable, as one person put it, "air rushing in and blood rushing out"

                    Of course for liability reasons we don't want the bullet to exit

                    The current thought is, more holes the better

                    The more holes there are the more leaks there are and the faster BP will drop, the faster BP drops the sooner there will be a loss of conscousness and the sooner the fight will over

                    Once we get past the marketing hype and jello shooting it's the same as it has always been
                    Last edited by ricco; 03-11-2018, 15:11.
                    "I suppose it's tempting, if the only tool you have is a hammer, to treat everything as if it were a nail...." ~Abraham Maslow~

                    "Skill makes you harder to kill" ~ Unknown

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      I make it a point not to carry a load that I can't get components for.

                      I do a little research to find out what passes the FBI protocols. I then like to chrono the real stuff, then duplicate the OAL & MV in my pistol so I have practice and reliability testing ammo. That limits what I have available to pick from, so I've stuck with Gold Dots; 147s in 9mm, 125s in 357SIG and 230s in .45ACP. No boutique stuff for me, unless I can order the bullets to load.
                      homo homini lupus est

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by ricco View Post
                        Carry what you like, it probably won't matter enough to make a difference

                        Certainly not enough to argue about

                        People stop fighting for one of two reasons, they are afraid they are going to die and want to get help or their blood pressure drops to a point they lose consciousness


                        It hasn't been that many years ago that people thought an entry hole and an exit hole was preferable, as one person put it, "air rushing in and blood rushing out"

                        Of course for liability reasons we don't want the bullet to exit

                        The current thought is, more holes the better

                        The more holes there are the more leaks there are and the faster BP will drop, the faster BP drops the sooner there will be a loss of conscousness and the sooner the fight will over

                        Once we get past the marketing hype and jello shooting it's the same as it has always been
                        Many moons ago, when the Marshall/Sanow book came out, the people interested in such things were dubbed either 'morgue monsters' or 'jello-junkies'. Which are you?

                        Me? I don't think there is enough evidence to persuade me one way or the other yet. There may never be. You have said it and it is certainly food for thought, that stopping power is as much psychological as it is physiological. Psychosomatic might be one way of putting it.

                        The simple truth of the matter is that we just don't know.
                        Taceant colloquia. Effugiat risus. Hic locus est ubi mors gaudet succurrere vitae.
                        The Pale Horse available on Amazon for your digital reader.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by gerhard1 View Post

                          Many moons ago, when the Marshall/Sanow book came out, the people interested in such things were dubbed either 'morgue monsters' or 'jello-junkies'. Which are you?

                          Me? I don't think there is enough evidence to persuade me one way or the other yet. There may never be. You have said it and it is certainly food for thought, that stopping power is as much psychological as it is physiological. Psychosomatic might be one way of putting it.

                          The simple truth of the matter is that we just don't know.
                          I remember the Marshall/Sanow book, I bought it and I believed it..........for awhile

                          Then the internet came along and we got to see the forensics for ourselves

                          The conclusions are today what they were yesterday will likely be tomorrow, everything works sometimes and nothing works every time

                          "I suppose it's tempting, if the only tool you have is a hammer, to treat everything as if it were a nail...." ~Abraham Maslow~

                          "Skill makes you harder to kill" ~ Unknown

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Federal 9BPLE 115 gr +P+ is a decent round that is pretty affordable if you can find it. It has a non bonded jacket....ricochet or pass thru may be less lethal if it fragments.Pretty honest assessment in the video of that round and ranger t +P+

                             
                            There is no lesson to be learned the second time a calf kicks you in the balls.....

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                            • #15
                              The Marshall/Sanow 'one-shot stop' results from their three books do not claim to be suggesting the 'oss' as a tactical goal. They simply note how many, out of the documented shootings in their samplings, of the fights were stopped with only one shot compared to how many took more than one round. The information was presented as a guide, not a hard'n'fast recommendation, as to what loads might be chosen for carry. For example, out of 100 incidents (just to make percentages easier), if Load A resulted in 95 oss's, and Load B resulted in 50 oss's, out of a particular gun, wouldn't it make sense to pick Load A? Even then, it's wise to be ready to fire as many rounds as it takes to stop the fight; but if it stops with just one round, well, yahoo! But low-comprehension people will glance at the numbers, not read the details, then think they got rooked if they pick a high-percentage load and have to use up more than one round to save their butts.

                              As to gel testing, those who are frequently described as 'gello junkies' mistakenly believe that results from gel testing should always represent results in flesh. They don't realize, or refuse to accept, that gel is a homogenous medium, flesh/blood/bone/organs isn't. One proper takeaway from gel should be that if Load C works well in real life, and that load tends to act 'this way' in gel, then it would be reasonable to expect that Load D, that tends to act the same as Load C in gel, should get similar results on the street. Sometimes, maybe most times, that's how it goes. But smart people know that things don't always work out logically; that's one big reason why, when a new bullet design comes out, it doesn't hurt to let other people be the testers in real life before trusting that new design to save my/our life.

                              Also it's fun to watch gel junkies' brains melt down when a particular load shows 'bad' results in gel testing, then turn out with stellar results in real life--or the other way around. It's Not Supposed To Work That Way! But sometimes it does. Ace2

                              edit to add: Since the last Marshall/Sanow book, there have been lots of development in defensive handgun loads. It would be great if they would do a fourth book, reprising those 'old' loads and looking at the new stuff. But that isn't going to happen, so we'll just have to make do with what information we can get the best way we can get it. Ace2 again


                              Last edited by Ace; 03-13-2018, 16:41.
                              Sometimes the term 'Idiot' is a description and not an insult.

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