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AAR: Process and Application – Rifle with Jason “Jabo” Long 5-7MAR

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  • AAR: Process and Application – Rifle with Jason “Jabo” Long 5-7MAR

    Took a 3 day carbine class MON-WED of this week down in Coffeyville, KS with Jason Long who’s a 16 year SWAT Sargent on the Memphis, TN SWAT one of the few (only a couple) full time SWAT teams in the US.

    BLUF: I learned a lot, and I would train with him again given the opportunity.

    This was my 10th or 11th training class I’ve attended (5th carbine) in addition to 23 years Army and a LEO academy (brief stint as reserve officer, went Army instead upon graduation from college).

    Instructor: Extremely knowledgeable, no chit one of the best shots as an instructor I’ve ever seen. Literally demonstrated every drill, test etc. at under par time. Stresses it’s “A Way”, but can tie every drill, method, TTP back to his team’s training and based off a real world situations and give a “why” he does it this way. Very, very dynamic individual and very funny! Also gives credit where credit is due on origin of drills, methods etc.

    Students: 16 in attendance, 12 were LEOs, 2 military (O5 & O4 Infantry types) and 2 retired military. I still work for the army and the other retired was SF is a long time shooter and instructor. Normally these classes are restricted to LEOs and active military. We were invited down after shooting a Dave Spaulding class with the same LEOs that sponsored this class. Interesting differences in how military solves a “problem” VS LE.

    Training/Instruction: Not a basic class………students were expected to show up fairly competent with both weapons.

    Heavy emphasis on precision, both handgun and carbine, tiny targets. Has a unique way of diagnosing accuracy issues which was very effective. One of the guys I was with brought his training aid back with us (yes, it was that good). The 1st day was primarily handgun, which was unexpected, but everything transferred over to carbine and helped with transitions.
    Had a couple really, really good cadence drills to work split times and get a realistic assessment of exactly how fast you can shoot and maintain accuracy. Similar concept with using enough sight based on target size, distance and time allotted. We worked this hard both pistol and carbine.

    Quite a bit of time spent working offsets at different distances, again ties back to precision. Long has a very well thought out step progression to his class, a crawl, walk, run methodology that took use from trigger control & sight alignment to 2 man leapfrog position shoots using VTAC barricades, blue barrels, picnic tables etc.

    He’s also very, very big on cognitive skills. Last instructor I worked with that stressed it this much was Rob Pincus. The class wasn’t just shooting, it was shooting the right tgts, in the right order, from the right position. One of these drills involved 16 different TGTs: shapes, people photos, colors, numbers etc. spread out across a 35-40yd front. Shot from the 3-7 yard line, a coach would call out the TGT and the shooter would move rapidly far enough right/left to engage. This went on for 45 seconds, at the end, most of us were smoked….

    “On Demand” skill tests, nothing like a 50 yard sprint 1st thing and engaging a 2” tgt with handgun and carbine to remind you what you need to work on.

    Lessons learned:

    Physical conditioning! I’m in pretty decent shape VS age, but need to get better if I’ll continue doing this!! The last day was the most physically demanding due to the nature of the drills, movement and position shooting. A VTAC barricade can be used as an effective torture device!

    Weather and Snivel gear: Be prepared, spend time shooting outdoors in some nasty chit. Shoot with gloves on!! This was an early MAR class, only an idiot signs up for an outdoor class early MAR in KS. We had below freezing temps with wind gusting to 50 mph on 2 of the days. It sucked, wore every piece of clothing that I could get on and still maintain the ability to move/shoot. Almost looked like that kid in Christmas Story….all of this makes weapon manipulation, accuracy, getting in and out of positions more challenging.

    Gear: I used my home built “Gamer AR”: Lightweight 16” Larue Tactical barrel, Leupold VX6 1-6X optic, Geisele SSA-E trigger, low-mass BCG & buffer. Worked great. After this I’m sold on the low power variable, I found it just as fast as an RDS, and when zoomed really helped with some of the thread the needle shots at distance. I would start the 50 at 6X, zoom down to 1X while moving FWD. Also the range holdovers can be used for offsets, my lower duplex junction is the aimpoint for 7yds, and the 350y index is spot on for 7y. So it’s no longer hold on top of forehead for a head shot, it’s now a question of which eye do I want to hit. Handgun, used my HK P30L with LEM trigger. No issues and we had some 35 yd pistol shots to start one of the drills.
    For this class I wore a belt rig VS my normal chest rig primarily because I knew it was going to be cold and access to the pistol would be problematic. Get a belt that allows for expansion so you can still breathe with all the cold weather chit on.

    In summary; Great class, great instructor and a really, really good bunch of guys. Large THANKS to the Coffeyville PD guys for having us down. I would train with Jason Long again, and that’s about the best compliment I can give. IF you got any additional questions, feel free to PM me.


    homo homini lupus est

  • #2
    Interesting differences in how military solves a “problem” VS LE.
    Could you please expound on that observation, and give us some examples?
    http://youtu.be/ei8OK4WdoW0
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_4CuH...e=channel_page
    http://www.stoppingpower.net/comment...tervention.asp
    http://youtu.be/wXwPtP-KDNk
    https://youtu.be/Iy71umadb6k

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by Goodtime Charlie View Post

      Could you please expound on that observation, and give us some examples?
      Couple examples:

      Military we have a tendency to "control pair" TGTs, granted it's due to the ammo used, but its a a TTP that everybody gets a pair (anybody worth shooting, is worth shooting twice). Actually a solution that the Ft. Benning guys came up with to address the effectiveness of the ammo. The LEOs did a single, then assess. Probably a liability thing that the MIL don't have to deal with.

      Also during the room clearing exercise, the 4 of us cleared the room of visible tgts slicing the pie through the doorway before entering, then finished by actually entering entering the room. Mil aren't normally trained for hostage stuff, so entering a room to "save" somebody isn't a normal concern. Normally when doing rooms/building it's clearing and the more that can be done prior to entry the better. IF there's really a chance that hostiles are within, something's getting blown up before anybody goes in. One of the better TTPs was actually, not entering through a door, and blowing a hole to create a new entry. There's a drastically different ROE and acceptance for collateral damage between the two due to one being the streets of USA and the other a combat zone.

      Using the VTAC barricade, we had a tendency to leave the selector on fire while engaging multiple tgts when re-positioning the rifle though different firing positions. This actually was caught by the instructor and we all went to safety when changing positions. The LEOs engaged the safety when they changed positions. We went to safe when moving, but simply went to finger off trigger when moving positions on the barricade. Safety doesn't normally go back on till the shooting is over, just not something any of us were trained on.

      During the movement drill with 16 tgts, the mil guys on average engaged at greater distances, rather than move and get square to the TGTs. This could be a primary VS secondary weapon thing, the LEOs are primary handgun guys, most of us trained primary on M4s.
      homo homini lupus est

      Comment


      • #4
        Thank you. Quite interesting. I see both techniques as valid. Finger off the trigger is a safety, in a manner. I also agree with the two-shot protocol, it makes sense. LE is too bound by PC ROE sometimes. Other times I think LE goes too overboard, like after the Boston Marathon bombing where the LEOs were pointing rifles at people in windows-totally inappropriate.

        SWAT should definitely look at the tactic of blowing holes in walls to make new entrances, as doorways can be death funnels, targeted and/or booby-trapped. Trappers use funnels to make animals walk into traps, so the military is wise to avoid them--LE should emulate this, IMO. Nowadays with spree killers and terrorists, I think a higher tolerance of collateral damage would be accepted by the public, but then each case could blow up into another Baltimore or Ferguson, so your mileage may vary, as they say.
        http://youtu.be/ei8OK4WdoW0
        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_4CuH...e=channel_page
        http://www.stoppingpower.net/comment...tervention.asp
        http://youtu.be/wXwPtP-KDNk
        https://youtu.be/Iy71umadb6k

        Comment


        • #5
          Honestly I don't think "we the people" want a merging of tactics, completely different environments and situations.

          As for the use of the safety, what the instructor taught made perfect sense, and I will adopt it. Flipping on/off safety really has no time consequence as long as either you or the gun is moving. The situation may very well change before you engage the next tgt, leaving you with a weapon off safe while assisting a partner etc. Just another precaution.
          homo homini lupus est

          Comment


          • #6
            Agreed.
            http://youtu.be/ei8OK4WdoW0
            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_4CuH...e=channel_page
            http://www.stoppingpower.net/comment...tervention.asp
            http://youtu.be/wXwPtP-KDNk
            https://youtu.be/Iy71umadb6k

            Comment

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